Another new member

[EvilTwin]

While looking for some info yesterday I stumbled across these forums. Looks like a lot of good info here so I thought I would join and introduce myself.

I've only been in the saltwater hobby for about 4 months and I can see how addictive it can be. I had a number of freshwater tanks over the years and when the wife and I decided to set up our tank again we decided to try our hand at SW. So, back in September I pulled out my old 60g hex tank and cleaned it up, did a lot of reading and decided to do a FOWLR tank. After filling it with 50 lbs of LR and 40 lbs of live sand I let it cycle for a few weeks and then began stocking with fish and cleanup crew. I had a few snail casualties early on, and lost two fish, which appeared to be more due to fish that were just sick when I got them. I'm much more picky about my selections now.

So the months went by and I kept reading about corals and other inverts. I wanted to get a BTA for my clowns (2 ocellaris). My wife had selected a yellow tang, against my better judgement due to the tank size, and it was starting to get stressed. I finally convinced her we needed to purchase a properly sized tank for the fish and others that we wanted to keep (the hex was too deep for any typical lighting) so it was off to the LFS. Fortunately for me, That Fish Place is only an hour from me so we had lots to choose from. We came home with a 75g perfecto, along with their Sedona stand and canopy. I also bought a Coralife Aqualight with 260 watts.

A little more than a week ago I set up the tank and migrated everything...sand, water, all of it. The move went well and the critters are happy.

Now for coarls...I had already bought a small frag of yellow polyps that declined rapidly in the old tank. In addition, the rock they were on litterally was just falling apart and the fish just destroyed the whole thing. I have maybe one or two polyps left. In addition, a single, solitary button polyp had hitchiked along with the yellows. It seems to be doing well and I am trying hard to pay attention to it so it will start to spread. How does it look?



So, yesterday I went back to TFP and returned something, and I just couldn't resist getting another coral. I figured on something hardy, so I focused on leathers. I bought what was in a tank labled Assorted Finger Leathers. This one had a lot of polyps out, so I brought it home. When I got it home I searched and decided it must be a Blushing Finger Leather. Here's a pic:



Many of the polyps on top did not come out as much as the othere, as you can see. I am wondering if this is because I put it too high up in the tank for now. When I bought it, it was down on the substrate at the store. Thoughts?

Anyway, I'll be posting some pics of the tank over in the more appropriate threads. This is a very interesting hobby that will no doubt have me broke in no time.

[FragOutpost]

Hello EvilTwin and Welcome to Frag Outpost.
Congratulations on your new tank. How are your alkalinity and ph levels?
Cladiella (Blushing Leather) is a pretty hardy coral and should do fine under most lighting conditions, but will probably prefer to be kept higher up when using power compacts. This coral also needs to be placed in an area of high flow.

Are you currently using any supplements or 2 part additives?
When you said that the yellow polyps just fell apart what exactly do you mean? Did the polyps just melt away or did each polyp detach itself from the rock and float away? Either way it sounds like some of your parameters are off somewhere.

Since you just set up the 75 gallon so recently I would wait at least 4-8 weeks for the tank to settle before adding any more corals. Do you have any detectable ammonia or nitrites?

How is the tang doing in the new tank? I'm sure it is much happier in the 75 than the hex.

One more question - What kind of lighting was the leather under at the store?

Thanks again for joining our community!

[EvilTwin]

Since you asked about testing levels, I just went and did a quick test. I was actually surprised to find that with the new strips I bought for quick tests, I was reading them all wrong and comparing to the freshwater chart. I didn't see the part about peeling back the label. Having said that, I am now maybe understanding a bit more about the testing. I typically use drops, but since things were always coming out at zero, nitrates, specifically, I was wondering if something was wrong. Anyways, with the strip I just used, here's what i came up with:

Nitrates: 40 ppm
Nitrites:0 ppm
Alkalinity: 300 ppm
ph: 8.4
sg: 1.023

I will retest all of these today with drops, but I have never got a reading on a nitrate test before. My ammonia levels have always been 0. One note to add is that on my hex tank, I ran a magnum 350 canister with carbon. I stopped running this on the 75g as I read about them being nitrate factories. If my alkalinity and ph are truely this high, how do I go about getting them down? Could it be that with the larger water volume, the amount of LR I have isn't keeping up?

As for additives, I started supplementing with SeaChem Reef Advantage Calcium after reading a lot of material over on garf.org. my calcium has always been on the low side, about 350ppm, so I wanted to start bringing this up.

As for the yellow polyps, the rock they were on was made up of a bunch of scrap garbage rock/pebbles, etc that was somehow just molded together. Basically after my snails and crabs got done cleaning around the polyps the rock started to disintegrate. I would wind up with a single polyp clinging to a crumb of gravel and they would get tossed all around the tank at night when the hermits came out to play.

Since I brought over everything from the hex tank I was not expecting to go through a full blown cycle in the new tank. I had a little cloudiness one day last week, which I suspected might be a bacteria bloom from a mini cycle but it went away within 24 hours. I do run a skimmer 24 hours and have a pair of powerheads (all of which I will be upgrading soon)
for flow. Since I am not using the canister any more, I need to up the powerheads to get more water turnover.

Yes, Bubbles the yellow tang is much happier in his new home. He loves to hang out with my ocellaris clowns. They all huddle in the corner for a while, then go swim off, then huddle.

As for the lighting of the leather at the store, what I saw was a hood over the tank that had halides and PC actinics. The halides were off when I was there. This kinda amazes me about this place. They are a pretty big place and have a large fishroom. That Fish Place has a big catalog, rivaling that of Foster&Smith. In their fish room, they have a large table-tank set up with their corals. The surface of the water is maybe 4 ft off the ground. The halide hoods over that table are maybe 3 feet or more over the water surface. I really wonder how much light reaches the corals in there. Any time I go to a LFS their tanks always look dimmer than mine, and I'm only running 3.5 watts per gallon. Anyway, the leather I bought was actually in a real tank with the halides off, along with a number of other soft corals. When I got it home I tested the water that it came in and the sg was like 1.021. Needless to say, I did a rather slow acclimation

[FragOutpost]

Your levels don't seem to far off. Ph is a little high but not by that much. 8.2-8.3 is ideal so 8.4 is not bad. Nitrates are a little high but this should not be too much of a problem considering the animals you have in the tank. Are you running anything other than carbon in the canister filter? It is ok to run carbon but try to stay away from things like foam or filter floss, or other things specifically designed to harbor aerobic bacteria. Adding more liverock or incorporating a refugium into your system may help with lowering your nitrates.

As far as additives are concerned you will want to dose a calcium additive in conjuction with an alkalinity additive to maintain an ionic balance. Also when dosing strictly calcium and alk you will also need to add some trace elements. A 2 part additive might be a good choice for you to start with as it takes most of the guesswork out of dosing since you add an equal part of each additive. Plus 2-parts also include trace elements. Just something for you to consider to make things easier for the time being. Your calcium and alkalinity demands at the moment are pretty low. 350ppm on the calcium is not that low and is actually close to natural seawater. Most SPS keepers prefer to elevate calcium to 400-450. If you find yourself constantly adding calcium but your levels do not increase then you likely need magnesium.

Sorry to hear about the yellow polyps. There is not much that can be done in that situation. At least the green polyp survived.

As far as powerheads are concerned, the tunze streams are great if you can afford them. If not then the seios are a good choice too.

Good luck with your tank!

[D12monkey]

One note that Frag touched on but really didn't go into too much is that if you dose the 2 part calcium/alkalinity additive then you will definately need to dose Magnesium as it is lowered when you dose the additives. Please make sure that you keep your magnesium up in order to have your corals and animals do their best.

[EvilTwin]

For calcium dosing, here's what I was reading and decided on trying. I figure if this works for the folks at GARF.ORG, it's got to be pretty good:

http://garf.org/milli/125.html

I spent a lot of time reading about their bullet-proof reef tanks and how to set them up. They recommend 55g tanks for their setups but I wanted to get more depth (width) to the tank so I went with 75. Their dosing calls for the use of Seachem Reef Advantage Calcium (in addition to other things), which contains proper amounts of Strontium and Magnesium. Now, I'm not going to discount anything you all say here, because I am a rank amateur at best in this hobby. But one thing I have learned over the years is that a reproducable system that works will typically yeild nice results. And since they have done much of the groundwork to make up this system, I figured I would try it and see how I make out.

As for dosing, since I don't have a sump, what is the best way to go about dosing the tank. I obviously don't want large clouds of calcium for my fish to swim through, looking for a meal.

[FragOutpost]

If you are going to dose additives individually then be sure to pick up all of the appropriate test kits for what you are adding. I only recommended the 2 part formula for its ease of use and convenience, especially for people just starting out who do not yet have very high calcium and alkalinity demands. In my opinion it is good to start out with the keep it simple method and gradually increase the complexity of your system. This way it will be easier to narrow down potential problems.

A good way to dose your tank in a slow and consistent manner is with a steady drip. This can be accomplished numerous ways including purchasing dosing equipment or build yourself a quick $3 doser like the one here - http://www.fragoutpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8
This is not absolutely necessary. You can just mix the additives with some tank water and add to your tank as necessary. The only way that you should have a cloud of calcium in your tank is if the calcium is precipitating which is not a normal occurance. Under normal circumstances these additives will not cloud your tank or have any adverse effects on your fish. As with any dosing regimine, start slow and increase your dosage as necessary. It is always easier to add more to a tank rather than take some out when you've added too much. Over time you will most likely develop a routine and will be able to spot problems before they get out of hand.

[FragOutpost]

Alkalinity is normally measured in dKH or meq/L. I am not used to seeing it in ppm so I just did the conversion a minute ago and 300 doesn't sound right. If you are correct and it is 300 ppm then that converts to around 17 dKH, which is very high. Strip tests are notorious for being not only inaccurate but difficult to read. The next time you visit your LFS plaese take a water sample and have them test for alkalinity and compare your results. Salifert makes a decent alkalinity test kit.